OK, Sharon we’ll bite. What’s the deal with the Ford Escape Hybrid? Is it true that The Blue Oval Boyz purposely restrict supply because they lose money on every one they sell? And the answer is… “There are regional spots of very high demand,” FoMoCo spinmeister Alan Hall told The Detroit News. “We are building to our production plans of 24,000 units per year (of Ford Escape and Mercury Mariner hybrids) combined.” Sigh. So, surely that’s it, yes? I mean we can’t very well talk about a shortage of GM’s hybrid SUVs, as customers for the two-mode gas - electric behemoths are lined-up none deep. Or can we? “GM’s other hybrid trucks, the full-size Chevrolet Tahoe and GMC Yukon, are hard to find, in part because about half of the automakers’ dealers opted not to sell them. Also, GM has produced the vehicles in limited numbers.” Aw c’mon Sharon, the reason GM dealers don’t have hybrid SUVs on their lots is that nobody wants them. By your own count, GM sold less than 1500 hybrid SUVs so far this year. Suggesting that GM dealers won’t stock them because they don’t want to “go through special training” is more than disingenuous. It’s lying.
Detroit News »
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dhanson865 Says:
July 7th, 2008 at 8:14 pm
It gets about the same gas mileage as a Camry Hybrid.
I’d buy one if it were cheap enough.
Lets see according to http://www.fueleconomy.gov the 2008 Prius gets 46 to the 2008 Escape Hybrid getting 32. For comparison the Camry Hybrid is 34 and the Matrix is 27.
Ford Escape $28,140 vs Prius $22,160. So Either the price has to drop or there has to be cash on the hood to the tune of $12,000 or there abouts for me to look at the Escape Hybrid seriously.
I don’t like SUVs but I’d seriously drive an Escape Hybrid if I could get one cheaper than a Matrix.
If that means no profit for Ford I guess that means they don’t sell them in large numbers…
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KixStart Says:
July 7th, 2008 at 8:33 pm
I can’t be 100% sure I didn’t miss one but the local Chevy dealer appears to have received 3. One was sold after 39 days and the other two are still awaiting sale after 76 and 60 days each.
Why spend $55K to get 22mpg when you could spend $35K to get 22mpg? The Acadia holds, nominally, the same number of passengers (probably not as comfortably but how often is the third seat going to be used by fullsize adults? Or used at all?) and tows just 1K lbs less.
Why bother with the big hybrids? This must be the Mother of All Marketing Mistakes.
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gamper Says:
July 7th, 2008 at 9:43 pm
You cannot really compare the Escape to the Tahoe hybrids. The Escape isnt really a true body on frame SUV, cant haul or tow like a Tahoe or carry the people like the Tahoe. I always thought it was a mistake to bring out the dual mode for Trucks and SUV’s when what Detroit really needed was a Prius fighter. Getting a combined 20 mpg in a vehicle as large and capable as the Tahoe is fairly remarkable, but it really boils down to a simple question. Do you want $hitty fuel economy or just medeocre fuel economy with a $10K price premium (or whatever it is)? It comes back to GM having the blinders on and only being able to focus on truck/SUV sales to maintain North American operations. Turns out 20mpg with a 10K price premium wasnt enough to fight the Prius.
One great thing that has happened in the “fuel crisis” is the the Detroit automakers are finally forced to let go of Trucks and SUVs and focus on building competitive cars again. There was a point there, around the time the SSR came out that I thought the next Vette would have a bed in it. Thank goodness for high gas prices.
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seoultrain Says:
July 7th, 2008 at 10:12 pm
Just had a thought. Isn’t GM’s hybrid SUV proof that GM saw fuel economy becoming an issue? That two-mode hybrid could not have been an easy, quick solution. It probably required years of research, development, and testing.
So GM clearly saw the possibility of gas prices rising further and people becoming mpg-conscious. And what did they do? Build a slightly more efficient behemoth, of which they will never sell enough to recoup the development cost. Nice.
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Captain Tungsten Says:
July 7th, 2008 at 10:49 pm
How long was the first generation of hybrid cars around (e.g. Prius, Insight) before they started gaining some traction in the marketplace, began being produced in significant numbers and became less costly through amortization of investment and the natural reduction of cost of components as they mature? Certainly more than one year. It’s a little early to declare the hybrid SUV’s a failure.
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RobertSD Says:
July 7th, 2008 at 11:38 pm
Well, for Ford, it’s both supply and cost. Farley made a comment that suggested the high demand and practically zero discounts could mean break even this year, but they weren’t counting on it. When the Fusion hybrid debuts, Ford’s hybrid program is supposed to be profitable thanks to new battery contracts, a less complex system to manufacture and more units absorbing dev costs (Ford’s GenII hybrid program).
Ford’s original battery contract was for 25,000 units per year. That was it. To get additional batteries from a Toyota-controlled supplier when Toyota itself couldn’t procure enough batteries would be prohibitively expensive. Ford would also have to make a trade off between building basically break even (or worse, depending on component cost) units or more profitable units of the regular line-up. Ford’s in no position to be losing money on something they CAN actually control when they’re losing money on so many other things they can’t effectively control.
Just to be clear, Ford isn’t alone in losing money on its initial hybrid program. Toyota probably didn’t have their hybrid program profitable until 2007. It’s not clear if Honda even does yet, and they sell about double the units in the U.S. that Ford does and have been the hybrid business even longer.
GM’s hybrids are failing for two reasons. The first is because they aren’t stocked anywhere. The second is that people are making real changes in their buying habits. It’s not just about ditching the gas guzzler. It’s about ditching the vehicle that you DON’T NEED! Very few people actually need a Tahoe. Those that need similar capability to this Tahoe Hybrid can hop into a Sienna, Odyssey, Flex or even GM Lambda and get similar gas mileage for tens of thousands less with only slightly reduced towing. And it isn’t a green statement because you’re still in a big freakin’ vehicle! No one will mistake this for a Prius!
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KixStart Says:
July 7th, 2008 at 11:43 pm
Captain Tungsten,
No, it’s not.
The Prius and the Insight were unprecedented but that was eight years ago. Hybrid tech is now an accepted part of the marketplace. If GM isn’t selling them, it’s either for lack of trying or lack of customer interest.
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Rix Says:
July 7th, 2008 at 11:46 pm
Seoultrain-
GM dual mode was developed for buses and garbage trucks. It was hard to scale down to regular car size.
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John Horner Says:
July 8th, 2008 at 12:07 am
I wonder where Ford is going to get the batteries for the Fusion hybrid? The buggers seem to be in very short supply.
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Geotpf Says:
July 8th, 2008 at 3:19 am
RobertSD Says:
July 7th, 2008 at 11:38 pm
Toyota probably didn’t have their hybrid program profitable until 2007.
Toyota claims that the Prius was profitable starting with the last model year of the previous generation (Model Year 2003).
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601213&sid=aJw5qY8pjIh8&refer=home
Now, nobody outside Toyota seems to believe them, but that is what they claim.
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I should be writing about this week’s show, but if you’ll excuse me I have to take a moment to say a few words about the stuff in the papers, which basically states Richard and James are leaving unless they get a million pounds a minute, and that Jeremy is already on four million pounds a minute and also trousers 98 percent of all the profits from Top Gear, Dr Who, Strictly Come Dancing, The Tweenies and Big Brother.